GoodFellas
We help our listeners discover what it means to be a modern man. We focus on how to heal and grow past mental, physical, and emotional traumas. The goal at GoodFellas is to provide men with the tools for us to thrive, not just survive.
Episodes release weekly on Thursday at 2am PST/5 am EST.
Throughout the show we invite the audience to meet some interesting and impressive humans who have navigated some of the deepest valleys as they journey to some of the highest peaks. Join me, Hosea Chanchez, as we seek to discover the GOOD in humanity and uncover some of the secrets to living a purpose-filled life.
About the Host:
Hosea Chanchez is a prominent actor, producer, and director, from Montgomery, Alabama. Soon after graduating high school, he relocated to Los Angeles, California to pursue acting. He immediately began booking commercial roles which kickstarted his career, where he has found long-lasting success.
He has appeared on shows like Girlfriends, Black Lightning, and All American, but is best known for his starring role as the quarterback football player, Malik Wright, on the CW/BET sitcom, The Game, and its 2021 revival.
Hosea has built an impressive career over the years and a large fanbase as a result. He started his company, A Very Good Company, in 2022 to provide black men and women with luxury products, reliable services, and quality content.
GoodFellas
Ep 101: 2023 & Me - How to Navigate Hard Years with Dr. Isaiah Pickens
Join host, Hosea Chanchez, as he speaks with co-host, Dr. Isaiah Pickens, to uncover the transformative power of facing vulnerability head-on. From surviving a severe back injury and temporary paralysis to juggling a high-pressure TV career while being my grandfather's primary caregiver, this episode highlights the critical importance of self-care and the harsh lessons that come with neglecting it.
Dr. Isaiah dives into how societal expectations of strength impact men's mental health, especially for black men. They discuss the emotional toll of maintaining an image of invincibility and the necessity of redefining success to prioritize relationships over material gains. Through heartfelt anecdotes and reflective discussions, Hosea challenge conventional notions of manhood and emphasize the need for spaces that foster vulnerability and mutual support among men.
As they recount the personal and collective losses faced in 2023, they share the journey of self-discovery through setting boundaries and embracing pain. This episode underscores the profound impact of authenticity and continuous growth, urging listeners to rethink traditional definitions of success and strength.
I fractured as a human and it was a really dark time for me because I had never had that type of invasive thing happen to me. Goodfellas is a simple mental space to heal and grow by a black man. For everyone who's listening, I'm Hosea Chan Chaz, and this is Goodfellas. On today's episode of Goodfellas, we're going to have an in-depth chat with my friend and co-host, dr Isaiah Pickens, about one of the years that held me back as a man, held me hostage, and that year is 2023. For me, 2023 was my worst year on record. I experienced some traumas and some things that, as a man, I didn't think that I could get past. Some traumas and some things that, as a man, I didn't think that I could get past. So in this episode, we're going to unpack those things so we can all heal and grow past them. So, fellas, join me so we can heal and grow In 2018,.
Speaker 1:I was walking to my car, leaving my house and I just regular, normal day went to open the door and all of a sudden, I dropped to the ground. I didn't feel anything, I just felt, all of a sudden, my knees. I just dropped. My knees hurt because I dropped to the ground and all of a sudden, for a quick second I'm like, why am I on the ground? But I didn't really comprehend what had happened to me. I had a herniated disc and my disc, once it protruded outside of its normal stance, it had pinched a cord, hadn't had any health issues, hadn't had any problems in my life up until that point, hadn't had any health issues, hadn't had any problems in my life up until that point. And so, going to the hospital and spending five days in the hospital, I was actually very concerned because I was paralyzed for five days. Wow, yeah, I was paralyzed for five days, couldn't walk, couldn't walk, couldn't do anything. And I got out of the hospital on the fifth day because they were able to give me some steroids and put the disc. The disc went back in, wow.
Speaker 1:And so that the doctor said you know, I was wondering why, you know what happened, what was the source of this? And he said it just happens to people, it can happen to anybody. And at that time I was in my early or in my 30s and I was very fit and didn't understand why my body was breaking down in this way. And so that set me on a path of, you know, doing yoga and finding ways that I could incorporate things that would stretch my body and not contract my body, and just finding new ways to physically work out, because I was a little afraid. I was a little scared for a couple of years after that. You know that something could happen again with my back. Fast forward to 2022. My back started acting up again while I was shooting my show, preparing or into season two, which is a really physically fit. I mean, it was a very physical season for myself.
Speaker 2:I'm saying you're a quarterback, quarterback.
Speaker 1:So these injuries are making sense. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.
Speaker 2:It's like y'all thought it was tv.
Speaker 1:Yeah right right right, it's real life.
Speaker 1:it's real life, and so I had to manage my pain. This was the biggest year of my life on this show. I'd been on this series for almost 20 years of my life and I'm finally getting the opportunity now to produce the show and to direct. Well, the season two was when I was shooting my first episode, and in the midst of season two is when I'm going through some of the most excruciating pain in my life. But what does one do, you know, when you have this opportunity and this chance to do something really cool and great in your life? I put my health aside and it's interesting now, because hindsight is, you know, 2020.
Speaker 1:As they say, as they say it really was a pivotal time and a pivotal moment for me to take care of myself, and I didn't. And that led me to the end of 2022. Going into 2023, we had to wrap the series, season two. I directed my episodes and I was on top of the world. I was looking forward to the next thing that's going to happen. This was in December.
Speaker 1:I'll never forget it, and when I flew, I'd flown back to LA, uh, for to be here more permanently now, cause I'd been doing a lot of traveling back and forth, um, during the two years that we were on Paramount Plus.
Speaker 1:And not only was I doing a lot of traveling from Atlanta to LA, I was also driving every weekend because I'm also my grandfather's primary caregiver in Alabama, and so I, at that time, we were being thrown into a really bad situation with him, where he needed, like around the clock, attention, care, you know, estate services, like everything, like his life, so to speak, was literally in my hands, and so I didn't skip a beat.
Speaker 1:You know, as soon as I got off work, I would drive home that Friday, whenever I wrapped on the show, I'd drive, get on the road drive to Alabama, which is about two hour drive from Atlanta to Alabama, to Montgomery, and so I do that drive Friday as soon as I got off every single Friday and drive into Alabama. If I had to go home to California, I'd do that on a Sunday, so I could come back on Monday and be scheduled later in the day. My life was literally insane, and so, fast forward to the end of 2022, into 2023, I had seen a couple of doctors because I knew something was wrong with my body. My hands were numb, they would be purple and cold to the touch all day, and then my right arm would start to go numb, almost like when a part of your body falls asleep.
Speaker 2:Like if you're standing on your foot or something, yeah.
Speaker 1:And so it had been this way for about three months and progressively it had gotten worse by the end of the shooting. Yeah, finally, uh went to my doctor who told me that that you know, it was a much bigger problem than I thought, than he thought it was. Um and lo and behold, it was no longer an issue that was just located in my l5 disc, which is what the one that herniated it had now become a problem in my upper uh discs. So I had to have a very emergency surgery and it was a scary surgery because I one there was a very small margin of what could be done. They replaced four of the discs in my back, in my, in my neck, four of those discs, through a small incision, like very small incision right here on my neckline, small incision near these four plastic contraptions in my body.
Speaker 1:Now I'll tell you a little bit about my doctor, because in the process of it the process of me finding a doctor one was very difficult and I have great insurance, but it was extremely difficult I found a lot of. I found the medical system that we're in now to be very manufactured. It's almost like things are a factory. It's a very scary system. I mean, you don't know this system until you get in the system, unless you're a professional that's working in that system. But doing that research, I come to a place where I couldn't get the doctors that I wanted, which was a blessing in the end, because I ended up getting one of the top surgeons that does this I mean, does this stuff in his sleep had done you know quite a few really, really really famous guys surgery. So I trusted his history to you know, rebuild my body to you know, rebuild my body and so went through that process.
Speaker 1:And the reason I'm telling you more specifically about this instance was because this was the very first time that I fractured as a human and it was a really dark time for me because I had never had that type of like invasive thing happen to me before. And so even after I had the surgery a huge meltdown after these things were in my body because I wasn't used to hearing like when it first did it, I could hear this clicking sound. It would go like click, click, click, click, click, like it would. I could hear it moving in my body. You were I robot, I was I robot, dude. I'm telling you man, and but what that did for me was it broke me down. I I I have a hard time even talking about that time because you don't you don't even anticipate shit like this happening to you. You know, you don't know it until it happens.
Speaker 2:And so once these things were in my body, I just felt less of a man in some weird way, and that's the reason why I don't talk about this but and it's crazy that we knew each other during this time and this is your first time actually sharing it with yeah, because I mean, these types of things weigh on us as men and we just carry that's right carry and we just carry until we can't carry anymore, and I mean and that's we got to talk about.
Speaker 1:Yes, because that.
Speaker 1:Yes, yes, carry the carry we'll call it the carry the carry um, and so it got me to thinking also, as I pause and relive that little moment with you guys. It got me to thinking about how many men and women encounter this types of stuff and just having to get up and go on and feed their kids and, you know, have much harder lives than we have in this little room, you know. And so it honestly, uh, gave me a lot of compassion and empathy, which is something that a lot of us men don't really know that we need until we need it, right.
Speaker 2:Yeah Right, can't give what you don't have.
Speaker 1:Can't give what you don't have and you don't know what you really don't know Exactly. You know me getting back to healing afterwards. I had a long healing process with this thing and I was very fortunate to you know, just a few months after in this and see that's also the thing too, because this type of thing plays on all your demons. It's like when your body is in this position, when you feel this type of vulnerable, when you need somebody to help you get out of bed and you know, wipe your ass and change you know your neck brace thing and all this weird stuff that you know becomes in a way such a human and a humane experience for us. You know, you learn other people because you're so many times we're strong for everybody else and then we don't really know how to be there for ourselves.
Speaker 2:That's real. You know what I mean? That's real don't know how to be there for yourself and especially, I mean you were going through this at the peak of your career, yeah, at the strongest you felt professionally.
Speaker 1:Absolutely yeah.
Speaker 2:And your body felt so weak and it's crazy the juxtaposition we have to hold things that are opposing sometimes but, we're told everything should be one way or the other. Either you're all bad or you're all good. Or you're all good, yes, and people don't know how to hold both at the same time, and I think what you're really taking us through is both the darkness and we're going to get to the light of having to hold both, because no one is all good all the time.
Speaker 2:No one is all bad, but it's hard to see that when you're in these moments.
Speaker 1:That's right To wrap that little piece up. What I needed to do for myself was to re-imagine who I was imagine who I was.
Speaker 1:I needed to rebuild myself in a way that wasn't going to allow me to hide and to uh, because that's also the thing when we are doing things for other people, we get to hide behind. Doing stuff for other folks, you know, and caring for other people and being the breadwinner and especially as black men we oftentimes put ourselves on the back burner for the betterment as I said when we were starting this of other people in our lives. And this process really taught me that I needed to rethink my manhood. Rethink my manhood. I needed to rethink what it meant for me to be a man, because a lot of it was based off of physicality. You know what I mean. A lot of it's based off of what you can do as a man and how that makes us feel, and when you don't have your body functioning the way that it normally does, when you need people to do things for you, you really realize that we're just as broken and fragile as everybody else, but right now we're not able to really get what we need to help ourselves, so a lot of us, as men, don't really care for ourselves the way we need to.
Speaker 1:I was always told that what being healthy was is working out. You know, I thought that if I went to the gym and and I mean this early age, my earlier years of being a man what, what it meant to be a man? Um, you know, caring for myself, caring for myself was going to the gym. That was, you know, a part of our culture, and no one really taught me, and a lot of us, how to safely care for ourselves and our bodies.
Speaker 1:What my body did a couple of years ago was really show me that my journey as a human being, and all men, our journeys. We are here to care for these vessels. You're supposed to make sure that you fine tune this, because this is your gift. This body is your gift. In the now we get to experience humanity, like what a great gift from God. Nobody really talks about the care great gift from God. Nobody really talks about the care that should go into preserving this thing for the long haul. But in my early forties, having that surgery, I realized that that's what the journey should have been from the start, you know, and it doesn't mean that things aren't going to happen to us Right, um, and another thing that I did well during that time was because of the way I cared for myself and I ate and I took care of myself, I was able to heal in a relatively fast time, um because you're wolverine?
Speaker 1:yeah, basically because I'm wolverine, bionic man and so I wanted to make sure that I changed the way that I live my life because of this and sacrificing myself. I felt like I sacrificed so much for my job, for my career, for my dream, for my family, for other people, but there were so many times in that instant where I just didn't feel safe having a conversation with other people about it. Just didn't feel safe having a conversation with other people about it, because and a lot of that and we can unpack that a lot of that has to do with the way I felt, um, I needed to present myself to my family and my friends and the people that I loved and I cared for and care for me you talked about masks.
Speaker 2:One of the biggest masks we have to wear as men is to always be strong, to always show up strong. That's a mask. I know we think that's who we are, but that's a mask, because it doesn't give us the freedom to be able to show up differently. And in that moment you felt like you had to keep going in the same kind of myth that you created of yourself. We create these myths of ourselves that we can't even live up to anymore.
Speaker 1:And now when?
Speaker 2:it's time for us to shift change. We need the support. We feel like we can't, you know, somehow, uh, dissolve or break apart that vision of success that our family has seen of us, that our friends have seen of us, and I think one of the most important parts of this is that the men that we admire have seen of us.
Speaker 1:We don't want to disappoint them.
Speaker 2:And so, even with the sharing between men, you don't want to be the man who doesn't look like he can't live up to the thing To life standard as a man, yeah, yeah, and I'm hearing that from you as you're talking about this moment because that was really that pain was a moment for transition. Because that was really that pain was a moment for transition.
Speaker 1:But because of kind of how you were conditioned your whole life and what you've been able to achieve, your, your one mode was to just push through, yeah, and it didn't give you the space to do what we're doing right now right, right to actively assess my body, my mind, my spirit and take whatever time I need to actually help myself get and grow and heal through whatever it is that we're going through, because the one thing that we all know, that is an absolute fact, is that everybody's going through something. You don't know what it is, but at this stage in our lives, with social media and with everything else, we can all see that every human on this planet has an issue with some things.
Speaker 2:So absolutely, I'm a psychologist.
Speaker 1:I got really issues. Can I tell?
Speaker 2:you about my 2023? I would love to hear about your.
Speaker 1:I want to tell you about my 2023.
Speaker 2:Yeah, yeah, yeah. I mean, one of the things that hit me, um, one of the things that hit me during that year that for me also is something very emotional, is my wife. She said to me one time she's like you're here but you're not present. I was always thinking about work. I was always thinking about like how can I do this? And it's like I married my partner and she doesn't even feel like I'm here with her when I'm here. And for me, it made me think what's the purpose of it all? Purpose of it all I'm out here wanting to do this to care for her, but she doesn't feel cared for in this way. That both helps her feel refueled and recharged, but also is important for me because it helps me really recenter with what's important in my life. And that moment really kind of shifted my started to shift my perspective in 2023 around how can I redefine success. Because I was defining success in such a narrow way. I was like I have to get my company to this place.
Speaker 2:I have to do this amount of work. I have to and there was no room for I also need to make time for my relationships.
Speaker 2:that's right, it was all physical, it was, it was, yeah, tangible tangible things, the material things that I could gain, and it was exhausting, but it was also it felt crippling in in, you know, not in the same way that you felt crippled, but in in kind of this emotional sense where I felt like I was again creating this myth that I was successful. But there were areas where I knew I was starting to fall by the wayside and I didn't have anywhere to share. That To land, to land, that, yeah. And for me a lot of this came to a head when I got a text and then a phone call later in the year. One of my dearest friends who I went to grad school with, he's social justice warrior, done so much amazing, amazing work, yale professor, been in so many different spaces. His cousin called and he said he had gone on this journey of enlightenment because he had the weight of the work that we do as psychologists and the weight of seeing injustice in the world.
Speaker 2:It weighed on him like no one I've seen before and um, I remember him saying he felt like he had come to a place where he came to terms with it, and it more sounded like he was in a space to to be able to kind of let some of that burden go, um, but I didn't know that that was the, that was the way that he had been thinking about and eventually decided to let that go. And I and I know that you know that story is heavy, but I think it speaks to just how life and death it is how we define what it means to be a man. It is how we define what it means to be a man, what it means for us to be able to create space for each other and to be able to check in. And that was a big part of our year last year.
Speaker 2:Um was being able to really create not only regular ways to see how we're doing, but to to practice being vulnerable. Right, it's actually it's not something that's natural for us, right, especially when you're growing up to be strong all the time. So the question becomes like how do you create spaces where you can share, and share in a way that not only feels authentic but it feels like you are getting from not only others around you, but particularly men. You're getting some support around, a new way to think about yourself, a new way to rebuild yourself, as we were talking about and, I think, for me.
Speaker 1:Well, let me ask you a question why did you, why did you not feel that it was? Why did you not feel safe to ask or talk to someone about what you were going through at that time?
Speaker 2:Yeah.
Speaker 1:What stopped you from reaching out?
Speaker 2:Yeah, yeah, you know, I think for me, a big part of what made it hard to reach out was I didn't know if the people I reached out to could carry the burden yes, and I thought I was putting more of a burden on them. Yes, yes, and and and so so it made me with the idea of being strong, I can carry this yes, too much for them right, I'm gonna carry this and wow, that's a big mistake.
Speaker 1:It's a huge mistake that we make as men. Yeah, it's ego too. I was about to say that it's arrogant. Yep, it's ingrained in that, in the savior mentality that we carry, that we need to save people in the world and ourselves and our dreams and our lives. It feels almost as if for us there's no room for failure.
Speaker 1:I know failure is supposed to be a part of the journey, but in our communities and as men, it's a very difficult thing to not be concerned with in your life because there's so much responsibility on us from such a young age.
Speaker 1:Just little boys, and a lot of this goes into what we'll be talking about throughout this whole season on the show is the culture that we create for young men and young women, which is completely opposite of what people say. It's the way we treat our young boys at a young age and our young women, over-sexualizing them, giving them so much responsibility at such a young age. Ambition is a great thing for all kids, but to feel like you have to carry the weight for your family, you work your whole life to build a life for yourself and then, when you do build a life for yourself, you know you're beholden to the hood or to where you come from, and the truth is, every human deserves to live a full, whole life. One great thing that I've recently learned is to make sure that I don't take on things that don't belong to me.
Speaker 1:And that also came from you know, uncovering and rediscovering who I am based off my body being broken, but I realized there's so much that I lived with that doesn't even belong to me. I don't believe in it. I don't want to believe in it. I don't feel it in my spirit, my soul or my body, and we all have so much of that on us.
Speaker 2:I completely agree, and I think it's not just what people give to us, but what we take on ourselves. And that we haven't learned how. What does it mean to set a boundary as a man?
Speaker 1:What does it mean to know your?
Speaker 2:yes and then everything else is no that's right, like really creating that space that allows you to feel empowered to say that, hey, yes, this is important, yes, I could do this, but should I?
Speaker 1:right, right, but should I?
Speaker 2:and and and that I think that is part of the journey of rebuilding ourselves. Because, yes, because I think that's so much of what it means to be a man sometimes is that you're certain that you are this way and that's it. And when we talk about rebuilding yourself, you're actually saying that that's not Rediscovering.
Speaker 1:You're throwing out the rule book, yeah yeah.
Speaker 2:I don't need to know everything right now, that's right, I can figure it out along the way.
Speaker 1:That's right.
Speaker 2:I don't have to have the answers in this moment and I just feel like, as men, there is so much power in saying I don't know, I don't know and I want to learn. There is so much power. There is so much power, I'm going to tell you something.
Speaker 1:First of all, the greatest gift when you become an adult that I learned as a man is that you ain't got a lot Like no, no, yo, that's real bro. A lie like no, no, I'm yo, you, you. I don't have to fucking lie to you and see. But see, and that's also in the dna of what you know. A lot of the things that we grew up with has taught us, but the truth is it's like well, actually, the truth is actually better than a lie, but the truth just makes you bold. You know what?
Speaker 1:I mean because really you're brave because nobody talks about the fact that lying is just being a coward. You can't tell the truth. You're just a coward. That's okay. We all go through coward phases in our lives. I've learned that there's so much liberation in the truth, and identifying and understanding what your truth is as a man is the most important thing that you can have possession of on your journey.
Speaker 2:I think that's so beautiful, because I think one of the things that we do when we're lying is we're saying we can't handle the truth and that the truth is too much for us to carry. That's right, and you know, part of what made me have a shift with my friend and after his passing was a journey. I went on a little bit after that. So my wife is Buddhist and she has really helped me understand something that I think a lot of us as men don't always lean into, and it's the beauty of embracing pain is, instead of avoiding, yes.
Speaker 2:What pain is? Yes, really lean in and learn from it. We lie because we're running away from the pain we think will happen from truth.
Speaker 2:That's right we lie because we're running away from the pain we think will happen, from truth. That's right, but when we say I want to embrace this truth, then it suddenly gives this space for us to lean in the pain, and I think for me that has been something that has been tremendously, tremendously helpful and it incorporates with how I see the world. She's Buddhist, I'm Christian and we have really been able to reimagine what it looks like for us to not run away from pain but to really make it a part of who we are and to learn the hard lessons.
Speaker 1:They're hard lessons, but to learn them in a way that helps us rebuild into something new something better, something beautiful and, speaking of that, a huge life lesson that I got that we learn things on our journey. I learned this. We all know this. What I'm about to say in our nature, somehow we know it in our DNA. But I know this now, which is different than learning or believing something, which is different than learning or believing something. I know that every single thing that happens to us in this lifetime is used for the greater good of our lives, which is used to push us forward. Not one thing we go through in this lifetime, not one thing holds us back unless we allow it to, but it is meant for us to move forward. Every single lesson that you learn in this life if you track them back, I've been able to do. One beautiful thing that God has gifted me with is a really cool memory in some ways, and I can retract certain things that happened in my life and I can remember from a very, very, very, very, very, very, very young age. I can remember from a very, very, very, very, very, very, very young age. People would be shocked. I mean like beyond your wildest belief of age.
Speaker 1:I remembered programming and and gathering information. I remembered how I learned things. I remembered how as I was learning them as a baby, when I couldn't ask for what I wanted how I got those things, and it is very, very, very similar to the exact same way that I operate now and a lot of us. If you do the research in your life, you'll see a lot of the ways you move throughout this world are very similar to the way you were when you were young, and particularly a young kid in grade school, because a lot of the way we move through school is a lot of the way that we move through life now, in the way our, our social lives are set up, very, very, very similar. And so I have been able to really hone in to see how the things that I wanted in my life, that I did not get, and the things that I did get, how they all line up with one another.
Speaker 1:Had it not been for this, this wouldn't have been, had it not been. So I'm a real knower of what it means. I mean, and again, like I said, it's a common thing. I'm wrapping it up now. It's a common thing, but I'm a real knower and believer in conscious choice and that we all have the freedom to choose, and God didn't set us up with a road and a map that is rigid. That is his way, and only his way. He gave us an opportunity to be human and to experience choice, which is the greatest gift God could give us, because we choose everything in our lives, and so that's how. I know for a fact that even the things that don't go right in our lives are all used to push us forward.
Speaker 2:Absolutely, and I love what you're saying about how it lines up with how you started as a child, because I think there's so many lessons from childhood that we don't even realize are a part of what's navigating us and pushing us. When we talk about this idea of resiliency, we're talking about how we bounce back from challenging situations, but bounce back in a way where we're learning something. There's a concept called post-traumatic growth.
Speaker 1:Post-traumatic growth yeah.
Speaker 2:A lot of people have heard of post-traumatic growth. You find meaning in the things that you've gone through, the more growth you'll have, whether it is less fear of what might come next, the uncertainty, the unknown of what might come next, more willingness to kind of lean into risky situations or friendships or relationships that you might have otherwise thought were a threat, but they are really there to help you, they're really there to support you, right.
Speaker 1:Right.
Speaker 2:And and I think sometimes, as men, we're so conditioned to that happened they're really there to support you, right, right and, and I think sometimes, as men, we're so conditioned to that happened. I'm moving on.
Speaker 1:That happened. I'm moving on.
Speaker 2:You're not taking the time to say what was the meaning of this pain. That's right and understand. How is this pain shaping the way I was seeing the world?
Speaker 1:I know for me.
Speaker 2:when my friend passed and as much as he had accomplished, part of what I realized was that I was a slave to exceptionality. I was working my butt off to be the most exceptional in what I did, every time Do you know how exhausting that is.
Speaker 1:Yes, I do. I know you do. I know it's extremely exhausting, I know you do is yes, I do, I know it's extremely exhausting, I know you do, I know yeah man, and and and for me that that realization came from the pain of understanding that my friend had pursued so much and and I want to honor his life what I do next. But that's how his story ended, at least for his physical life, right, right for this journey, for this journey.
Speaker 2:And what was the lesson I was supposed to take from that so that I could continue to move forward? And that was one of the lessons, because I realized that-.
Speaker 1:You asked yourself that. What was the lesson in it?
Speaker 2:Yes, I did.
Speaker 1:Really, and you want to know the way I got in his suicide.
Speaker 2:Yes, okay, yes and you want, you want to know how I got there. It's kind of so. So I did something very different after this, um uh, I went on a 10-day silent meditation retreat oh, that sounds incredible it was, it was like nothing I had done before. But when you experience, you know, uh, something that's so devastating you, you, you want to find something that re-centers you and that maybe you hadn't thought of as a way, and even as a psychologist?
Speaker 2:I've never done anything like that, but it was during that time one I didn't realize how loud my mind was, constantly going, constantly going. But when my mind quieted down and I was really able to sit with what 2023 had been for me and that you know particular piece of it. Um, I realized that so much of what I was struggling with was that the myth that I had built was that I was exceptional, so I always had to live up to that myth yeah, and I said why don't I have the right to be just normal?
Speaker 2:just be like anyone else be like right, you know I'm gonna get there, you know when I get there.
Speaker 1:Yeah, I'm, why don't you?
Speaker 2:I'm gonna do what you asked me to do, but I'm not gonna go a thousand percent over and above right and and it's nothing wrong with that. But when you're doing that all the time, that becomes your identity. It becomes so not only.
Speaker 1:Well, there is something wrong with that though.
Speaker 2:Well, no, it's nothing wrong with going above and beyond, is what I mean? Like hard work is great, but when it becomes who you are, and that's the only way you know how to be.
Speaker 1:That's your identity.
Speaker 2:It's your identity, when it becomes your identity, when it becomes your identity, when it when it becomes.
Speaker 1:being successful means I will work myself at all costs I don't care what the cost is yeah, that's when it starts to become not only unhealthy, but you get into these situations where you don't start to realize the warning signs that you're starting to go down a path that that isn't healthy but most people are there, though I think you don't yeah, and the exceptional mindset of what today means for men, young men, um, I mean, either you're really super lazy in society and you don't give a damn and you smoke weed all day and you're just like whatever and you got rich parents, or you're going to be okay because you're in Bitcoin, or whatever the case is, or you are a man who is quite the opposite and is very concerned with your livelihood, with your family, with the times we're living in, with social media, with you know the radioactive waves in the sky there's so much with the president who's chosen with it.
Speaker 1:If there is a man out here that does not have that mentality, he should reach out to me because I need to know what he's doing. I think all of us are in that perpetual cycle right now of exceptionalism, but it's not really exceptionalism, it's just survival it is no Bible, it is survival and it's a vibe in our minds.
Speaker 1:Yes, survival, because it's not survival. That's that's actually what we're saying. Yeah, is that that's not survival?
Speaker 2:we are showing up at survival. We're showing up in a way where we think we need to survive things that you know we may not, and I think I think the thing, the caveat with what you're saying, though, is one the the you're either this or that. Sometimes, our perceptions society puts on men yes, particularly black men that you're either this or that. Sometimes, our perceptions society puts on men yes, particularly black men that you're either kind of an exceptional human being or you're doing nothing that's not creating what is the reality of there's?
Speaker 2:there are actually a lot of people in between and the gray area is where most life should be exactly yeah, exactly, and, and that's where families are built and children are raised, and yeah, man and, and I think part of being able to really deal with some of this pressure that comes from exceptionality is knowing that there's other ways to be and having other models that help you understand that and not believing what society is telling you of these boxes that you need to be in, Because I think that so much of why we feel the pressure and the weight is because we have narrow ways of what we expect of ourselves.
Speaker 2:Like you're either achieving at the highest level or you're a complete you're a loser.
Speaker 1:That's not the reality at all. Of what life is that also comes from the way we treat one another Like. Think about how competitiveness, like it, breeds that, because we start to feel like there's only one for the life of me. There's this new thing that's happening on the internet, and we're all familiar with it, where there is a sickening desire to tear people down and to compare I've never seen anything like right on the internet right and to to pit one another against one another, but most recently is with drake and kendrick.
Speaker 1:For the life of me, I don't understand. We, as black people, won both ways, like we won, because all these kings are at the top of this throne, all of these guys got a place at this table. Yeah, that's why we're economically and and physically and mentally as strong as we can be. But unfortunately, our mentality is what makes us the weakest. Because if you believe in enemies or you know other people out there who aren't really um in favor of of a culture in general, whoever they may be, our strength and our power comes from our economic like. Think about all of these guys that did a diss track against drake and drake's against them, all of them, all of them. I'm not saying one or the other, all. Just think about the economic power of all those men. Like a charity, just one record or each record was for charity. Just imagine if those gentlemen, all of them, decide one day that they're going to own who they really are and stop dissing one another in some stupid ass way on a song and realize that ultimately we are all we have.
Speaker 1:Yeah, we're tearing each other down so absolutely, and and until that mentality leaves, though, and we're always gonna feel like we have to compete.
Speaker 2:We have to compete with one another and that there is not enough yeah, and our children and I, and I think the beauty of being human is that you can be both right, you can be multiple things and, like you were saying, with Kendrick and Drake and all these other folks, they still can take that economic power and push it toward Africa, push it toward wherever they want, and and and and really, um, be people who you know, have had this history and done this, but also are doing these good things. I think part of what happens with us as men is we think that we have to be one thing or the other and, like you said, we're comparing ourselves to each other as opposed to really appreciating and understanding how far we've come in our own journey.
Speaker 2:I think there's so much is about understanding where you are in relation to other people on their journey, as opposed to understanding how far you've come in your own journey.
Speaker 1:Right, but it's impossible to do that when you live in a society that the standard. It is not impossible. Excuse me, I should not say that it's hard to do. When the standard, when the culture, like the culture is, is, is the, the vibration of a people. That's what culture is. It's the heartbeat of what makes people beat. When the culture is telling you this is what it means to be a man, you don't see your success, you don't see how well you've done because you can't.
Speaker 1:You're so occupied with what other people are telling you, because the standard and the metric of what it means to be success is based off of what the ether is giving these guys yeah so it won't ever be better until it's better for everybody. You know what? I'm saying like it has to be a collective conscious for us as a people to make certain changes.
Speaker 2:I agree, I agree, and I think part of that collective conscious is us really being able to be real about these types of experiences that have built us to where we're at Right and and like we said at the start of this, there's no one who isn't going through anything. I don't care what, how rich you are, I don't care how smart you are, how beautiful you are, whatever it is Right, you're all of those things Beautiful, smart, rich, favorite.
Speaker 1:Oh, I'm sorry, ok, okay. Well, your list should be over by now but, but I do think, uh, that you're.
Speaker 2:This collective consciousness is a part of the journey and it takes people willing to take the risk.
Speaker 2:And you know, part of what we want to do here on goodfellas is we want to take that risk. We want to create spaces where you're seeing us and others who are on this show in this time with us, really be able to lean in the spaces that you wonder what's behind the curtain. If you're dealing with these challenging situations, if you want to create a different way to show up. You want to rebuild yourself as a man. What do you actually do to get there, show up? You want to rebuild yourself as a man. What do you actually do to get there?
Speaker 2:And I think that, for us, my hope is that Goodfellas becomes something that you create, your own Goodfellas in your own circle. Right, you start to find those Goodfellas who challenge you and push you to be able to say I can rethink how I'm showing up as a man. I can rethink how I'm showing up with the things that I'm defining as success, and doing it in a way that you know gives us a chance to practice being something new, being something different, and I think that's that collective consciousness that will grow.
Speaker 1:One thing you spoke about a second ago was your loss in 2023. And that has been An unbelievable Amount. There has been an unbelievable amount Of humanity, of men, who have had a extreme amount of loss. One thing we're going to come back and talk about is loss Specifically, and how it affects us all, and it has affected us all. I'd like to thank you guys personally for watching today's episode, and I'd also like to ask you to spread the word about our community. We're small and we're mighty, but we're healing and growing as men, and thank you in advance for helping share that. I'd also like to thank Dr Isaiah Pickens for coming through and just being a brother, being a sounding board and a friend, and everybody needs that in their life. So if you want to help us keep the conversation going or if you need to have a chat yourself, you can always reach out to us on our Facebook, our Instagram or our TikTok. Fellas, let's grow.
